Clone Beer Founder's Breakfast Stout Clone

when i add the sparge water and let that sit for 10 minutes, wont that stop the conversion?

ok, was just reading in How To Brew about how skipping the mashout with oats in the grist could cause a stuck sparge, so what if i mashed the oats seperately on my stove in a mesh bag, then i could skip the mashout?

I brewed this with a 10gal rubbermaid mash tun. Worked just fine. If you need, thin your mash volume. But don't skip mash out.

However, I think you ma misunderstand mashout. In batch sparge, your sparge IS the mashout, so to speak. Use 185-190F water after draining first runnings fully. This will raise the grain temp to mashout temps very quickly.

As far as stuck sparge, I wouldn't worry. As long as you stir properly and get that mixed, you'll be fine. If you're new at all-grain and trying to brew a big recipe, go ahead and accept that you're probably not going to nail your target gravity. But that's OK. Trust me, it'll be fine.

Use Green Bay Rackers calculator (google it) to determine mash volume, which in turn helps determine how full your cooler will get. Always add 1/2-2/3 gal extra to the Rackers figure.

I skipped the mashout and the mouthfeel is just fine so YMMV. I batch sparge, though, and it's off the grains pretty fast. Might be different with fly sparge. I used a 10 gallon Igloo and it fit. Keep in mind, depending on your efficiency, you might need to scale back the # of grain. I used 13# of two row for just over 17# total and used 1.1qts/# for the mash and it worked fine.

nickmv said:

I brewed this with a 10gal rubbermaid mash tun. Worked just fine. If you need, thin your mash volume. But don't skip mash out.

However, I think you ma misunderstand mashout. In batch sparge, your sparge IS the mashout, so to speak. Use 185-190F water after draining first runnings fully. This will raise the grain temp to mashout temps very quickly.

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Good point. I guess I should say I skipped a separate mashout and sparged with hot water too.

Yeah, I think people may misunderstand how mashout works with batch sparge.

thanks guys, this is what i wanted to hear, i might just get a few less lbs of 2row and ill just drain the first runnings and go straight to sparge with some hot water.

matt514 said:

thanks guys, this is what i wanted to hear, i might just get a few less lbs of 2row and ill just drain the first runnings and go straight to sparge with some hot water.

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Yeah you should just use whatever amount of 2 row will get you to the OG based on your system's efficiency.

actually im really new to all-grain and i wouldn't even know how to figure out all this efficiency stuff, i just built myself a 10 gallon home depot mash tun and just got a propane burner (bayou sp10) and a 9 gallon stainless pot from AIH. i have a few extra 5 gallon pots to heat up sparge water in too. so thats my system, how would i begin to start figuring out my efficiency?

ideally you want to add boiling water to raise the temp on your mash to 166-170*F before you take your first runnings.

if you don't, you're pouring off 150*F first runnings that will continue to convert.

but as pabloj13 pointed out, YMMV. worked fine for him without a mashout. i don't mashout on beers that i want really dry, but thicker beers really benefit from getting the first runnings to mashout temps in my experience.

matt514 said:

actually im really new to all-grain and i wouldn't even know how to figure out all this efficiency stuff, i just built myself a 10 gallon home depot mash tun and just got a propane burner (bayou sp10) and a 9 gallon stainless pot from AIH. i have a few extra 5 gallon pots to heat up sparge water in too. so thats my system, how would i begin to start figuring out my efficiency?

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Honestly, it might be better to tune your system in on a simpler beer. Are you crushing the grain yourself? Batch sparging? I was all over the place on efficiency until I got a grain mill. Now I am 75-76% every time. I might drop a couple points on higher gravity beers like this one. It's hard to guess what your efficiency would be off the bat.

Therein lies the fun -- finding your efficiency. I can tell you that if you have a good crush on your grains, that your setup will yield between 70-80% efficiency in most cases. But you just have to find out on your own.

You mentioned your setup, but you didn't mention any sort of screen for your bulkhead/valve, etc. Do you even have your mash tun converted with a ball valve and screen or false bottom? If not, you MUST do this. Otherwise, you're gonna have a really ****ty time.

yes, i have a stainless steel braid and a ball valve on my mash tun.

Just ordered grains for a slightly different variation on this grain bill. Can't wait to brew it!

Just cracking the first one of these, brewed in early December. Fantastic recipe!

subscribed. I wanna try this as my first all grain

Brewing this stout today. I'm using wyeast 1056 and using more nugget to bring the IBUs up to about 54. Looking forward to this big brew, it's my 4th all grain cook.

Got Honorable Mention in Russian Imperial Stouts with this recipe! 41.5 points!

If I can't find cacao nibs, how much cacao powder should I substitute for? Should I add this any differently? I've never used cacao in brewing before. Thanks.

Vigo_Carpathian said:

If I can't find cacao nibs, how much cacao powder should I substitute for? Should I add this any differently? I've never used cacao in brewing before. Thanks.

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I just used a combination of unsweetened and bittersweet chocolate. Worked great.

pabloj13 said:

I just used a combination of unsweetened and bittersweet chocolate. Worked great.

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How much of each did you use and at what time? Thanks. I was thinking of using the powder because I already have it in my cabinet.

I used raw nibs for the second batch and unsweetened coco powder for the first. Coco powder as much better imo

Vigo_Carpathian said:

How much of each did you use and at what time? Thanks. I was thinking of using the powder because I already have it in my cabinet.

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You can see what I did here.

Here were my extras:
2oz ground sumatran coffee at flameout

2oz ground Kona, cold pressed, at bottling

2.5 oz dark bittersweet chocolate at 15'

1.5 oz unsweetened chocolate at 15'

I know some have used powder before. I just had solids laying around.

Sounds good. I have powder already so I think I will use that. If I can eventually find some nibs, I might use some in secondary. I saw a tag for them at Whole Foods but they were out.

Powder is what you want to use in the boil. You don't want to boil the nibs.

Nibs are ideal for secondary however, much better flavor when beer is sitting on them, and they are alot cleaner!

FATC1TY said:

Powder is what you want to use in the boil. You don't want to boil the nibs.

Nibs are ideal for secondary however, much better flavor when beer is sitting on them, and they are alot cleaner!

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How come the original BYO recipe calls for adding nibs at flameout?

I brewed this yesterday and followed the recipe (basically) exactly. Can't wait to see how it turns out.

I tasted the first bottle of my second batch of this recipe yesterday and it turned out fantastic. OG 1.096, FG 1.032. Great head retention, wonderful aroma, it is very close to the original. Will have to do a side by side comparison with a bottle of Founders Breakfast stout this weekend.

Thanks again for this awesome recipe!

Transferred my batch to secondary yesterday after 2 weeks. My OG was 1.074, 1.022 yesterday. Coffee taste was prominent and it already tasted pretty decent.

run42beer said:

I tasted the first bottle of my second batch of this recipe yesterday and it turned out fantastic. OG 1.096, FG 1.032. Great head retention, wonderful aroma, it is very close to the original. Will have to do a side by side comparison with a bottle of Founders Breakfast stout this weekend.

Thanks again for this awesome recipe!

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Good to hear, those were my numbers exactly too. I was worried about it finishing too high at 1.032. How long did you age this? I was thinking four months and then kegging.

Brewed my batch last night. This was my third all grain batch and my biggest beer so far. Ended up with almost 6 gallons at 1.074. Started at 8:15 and finished around 2:30am last night putting the beer in the closet. I started off my mash close to 158 and got it down to 155 degrees after adding some extra water. By the time the water level was right it was about 7 gallons of water in the mash.

I tried to mash out, but I think the water was not hot enough and my grains never got above 158. I used about 3.5 gallons to sparge including the gallon I added on top of my mash. I ended up with more wort than I could fit in my 9 gallon kettle and boiled down until hot break and added more wort once it dropped an inch. Ended up boiling for 2 hours total, with hops being added after the first hour. I upped the hops to 1 ounce nugget and also added an extra 1/3 oz of magnum hops since I had a couple immediate boilovers and may have lost some. My first runnings measured 1.063, and sparge was around 1.031. Pretty sure I was close to 9 gallons of total runoff, just did not have enough time to boil it all down.

Other than bumping up the hops, I used cocao powder instead of the nibs and everything else was to the recipe and everything else went smoothly. It was on its way 6 hours later in my closet at 73 degrees and I added frozen water bottles to cool it into the 60's. Will have my roommate check on it when he gets home after lunch. Fermentation temperature control will be the main focus now. Still need to set up a chamber.

It was so dark, and smelled like coffee like nothing else. It was too late to drink all my sample with coffee in it last night.

Here are a couple pictures.

2 weeks in and it went from 1.074-1.020. It was almost pitch black and had massive coffee flavor when I tried it Saturday. I am thinking I will probably just do the whole batch in primary with no secondary. I need to clean my extra carboys and don't have an extra, and I think whirlpooling left most of the coffee behind in the kettle.

My carboy temps have ranged from about 64-70 with mostly around 65-68, still need to improve my temperature control and get a a fridge for it, but otherwise its rolling along smoothly. I am thinking to go 5-6 weeks in primary, but will see what the temperatures are like in my house. 4 weeks at a minimum in fermentation if temperatures become hard to control.

Just bottled mine yesterday. 15 days in primary (went from 1.071 - 1.017). 3 weeks total in secondary. Last 1 week with the second coffee addition. I coarsely ground the beans and made a sack out of some leftover voile material I had. Used 4-5 marbles, but I guess I underestimated the buoyancy of coffee because it still floated! It was a b*tch to get the sack out, but I'm glad I did it to avoid getting any coffee in the bottles. It looked awesome so far with very strong coffee aroma and taste. But I like a lot of coffee flavor in my coffee stouts. It would take a lot to say a coffee stout has too much coffee (though I've tasted a few). I know the consensus seems to be wait to drink it, but I will probably taste one at 3 weeks after it's carbed and then every month thereafter to see how it changes (I already put reminders on my calendar )

What would be a good substitute for Kona? I haven't tried it, so I don't know much about the flavor.

I am now at 5 weeks primary and plan to bottle this week. I might go ahead and order some Kona from amazon,

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B002Z613JO/?tag=skimlinks_replacement-20

otherwise it was $40 a pound at Central Market. Trader Joe's didn't have any Kona when I checked. It's either that or use some of the sumatra or Medium Guatemala coffee beans I have.

I made one batch of this beer. It was so incredible, and so close to FBS, that it actually convinced me that I knew something about brewing. I used Papanicholas French Roast (because that's what we drink), ground from beans in our mill and dumped in at flameout per recipe.

I just tasted my attempt at this 3 weeks after bottling and it was excellent. It was my first AG batch (BIAB). If it gets better with age, I can't wait.

Just tasted my 1st go with this beer as well. It was made in early March and kegged last week. Unbelievably good and pretty darn close to the real FBS!

Brewed this for the 2nd time, first time was extract and this time was all-grain.
I used 2oz of Sumatra brewed in a French Press added to the end of the boil along with 2.50z of bittersweet baker's dark chocolate and 1.5oz of unsweetened baking chocolate that I melted in a double boiler and stirred it right in.
Then transferred to a secondary after 2 weeks on top of 2oz of organic cocoa nibs and 2oz of cold brewed Kona coffee for a week.
Kegged it last week and its pretty well carbed up now.
Very smooth mouthfeel from the oats with a nice balance of roasted malts.
Only thing compared to my first batch is the chocolate is super up front and takes over completely. It almost tastes like pure cocoa with a slight dry nuttiness on the palate.
I had a year old bottle of my first batch a few weeks ago and after a year it has blended perfectly with the coffee.
Since this is only my 2nd chocolate beer just want to gather people's opinions on how long it will usually take for the chocolate to mellow out.
Most of this batch is actually going to be a wedding gift for a very close friend and the wedding is in September so its about 4months until he'll get it and I'm hoping the chocolate takes a step back and lets the coffee and roasted malts come forward more.

I've only had 1 bottle of mine that was only in the bottle for 3 weeks and I thought the chocolate was too week. Did you do anything different between the two batches regarding the chocolate? I'd actually like more. I actually want to brew a Southern Tier choklat to get more chocolate.

mtnagel said:

I've only had 1 bottle of mine that was only in the bottle for 3 weeks and I thought the chocolate was too week. Did you do anything different between the two batches regarding the chocolate? I'd actually like more. I actually want to brew a Southern Tier choklat to get more chocolate.

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I wouldn't judge it at all at 3 weeks. This beer changes A LOT over time.

Oh I get that, but wouldn't the chocolate fade? Or will the coffee fad more exposing the chocolate more? I love the coffee flavor as is, but that would be good if that happened.