Safale S-04 -- Super Cloudy/Not Settling Out?

So i tried my first batch with S-04 on a pale ale i have done many times with the S-05 and Pacman yeasts and the beer usually came out [almost] crystal clear with a very nice hop profile...However--with this new batch (S-04), the clarity of the beer is significantly compromised and has a great deal of suspended yeast in the bottles (after ~17days conditioning)

Question -- (1) Does the S-04 take longer to bottle condition or is this just how this yeast works?

(2) Does anyone know how to get these suspended yeasters to fall to the bottom of the bottles so I can avoid pouring them into my beers?

(3) WTF happened to my hop flavors with this yeast strain?!

prjectmayhem said:

So i tried my first batch with S-04 on a pale ale i have done many times with the S-05 and Pacman yeasts and the beer usually came out [almost] crystal clear with a very nice hop profile...However--with this new batch (S-04), the clarity of the beer is significantly compromised and has a great deal of suspended yeast in the bottles (after ~17days conditioning)

Question -- (1) Does the S-04 take longer to bottle condition or is this just how this yeast works?

(2) Does anyone know how to get these suspended yeasters to fall to the bottom of the bottles so I can avoid pouring them into my beers?

(3) WTF happened to my hop flavors with this yeast strain?!

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In my limited experience with this yeast (3-4 batches as I recall) here is my take:

1) Cold crashing before bottling is a must for clarity with this strain. Irish moss in the boil really helps too. If you really insist on sparkling clarity, gelatin is advisable.

2) Not if you cold crash first. But if you cold condition the bottles for a week, I bet they clear up some.

3) The esters of the strain do seem to mask some hop flavors, but then if you drink a British pale ale or IPA and compare it to an American one, you know that. Dry hopping after primary fermentation is done (in the same vessel or racked to a secondary- your call) really helps if you want a more pronounced hop character.

Hope this helps.

Thanks for the quick response--One question about "cold" conditioning -- What temperature do you suggest for this? Like straight up in the fridge (~36F)? or somewhere in the 50s?...

When I bottle I go 2-3 weeks at room temp and a 1-2 weeks in the fridge before drinking- but I don't have a place where I can consistently get temps in the 50s or 40s (thus the reason I don't do lagers.)

My few experiences with this yeast have resulted in a vigorous ferment followed by a remarkably compacted yeast cake. How were your temps?

I got a vigorous primary fermentation at ~67f and then ramped to 70-71f for secondary...

Hmm.. I wonder if the increase did it. Not that you went overboard IMO. Sometimes other factors that we cannot measure at our level of production happen, I guess. Someone else might have an idea, but a 4 degree bump sounds pretty tame. I have fermented sa-04 at 70-72 before with the same dense, compact cake each time, just a touch more ester perhaps than when I did it in the 60's...

did you rush to bottle this batch or get a lot of trub in your bottling bucket?

I use s-04 a lot and it drops like a stone., compacts hard and leaves minimal sediment in bottles. what sediment is in the bottles is usually stuck to the bottom in 3-4 weeks and you can pour right off it.

woknblues said:

My few experiences with this yeast have resulted in a vigorous ferment followed by a remarkably compacted yeast cake. How were your temps?

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Me too! I don't care so much for the flavor of this strain (and so only use it in stouts or something like that), but one of the reasons I use it is because it drops like a rock and forms a very tightly compacted yeast cake and results in an ultra clear beer.

My experience has also been that the S-04 produces a very tight sediment and leaves clear beer.
In contrast, I used S-05 for my latest Imperial IPA and the sediment was clumpy instead of a flat cake.

I just used s-04 in a smash English IPA and it was clearer in the bottle after a week than beers using 05 or notty were after 3.
I'm guessing it's more chill haze and hop debris than yeast.