Clarity in Question

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dummybrewman

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Well my Irish red is very tasty I must say, however I have a question about the clarity of my beer after refrigeration. I have my beer perfectly carbonated, so I have been chilling a few brews. I pulled one out, and the clarity it once had is now gone. What has happened to my brew?
 
Sounds like chill haze to me. You can use Irish Moss at the end of the boil and then cool it down to pitching temps as fast as you can to help with that. Or you can leave the beer in the fridge for a couple of weeks and the haze will drop out.

Just cosmetic though and does not affect the flavor any.
 
Chill haze, caused by proteins still in suspension. There are a couple fixes for this while you are making the beer (irish moss, quick chilling, cold crashing, etc.) but not much to do after the beer is in the bottle. Fortunately, it only affects the appearance and not the taste!


Which is pretty much what Varmintman just said while I was typing :D
 
Thanks guys. Brewing an English Bitter right now. I bought Irish moss the last time I hit the brew store, so hopefully this will help. I am at pitching temps in 6 mins, so I think I am good with that, and clarity in the bottle at warm temps is super clear!
 
The best fining agent, in my opinion is gelatin. Irish moss helps, but its never as clear as with gelatin. It may be a little bit more work, but if you want your beer to be crystal clear, use that.

Put 1 pouch of knor no flavor gelatin in 1 cup of hot water (60-70 ºC). Wait for it to cool down (ice bath), put it in your fermenter 2-3 days prior to bottling and but the fermenter in your fridge or in the coolest place you can find (above 0ºC of course). Then when you bottle, just make sure you don't disturb the bottom and you'll have crystal clear beer!
 
Chill haze is actually an interaction between proteins and polyphenols. Someone helpfully posted this link in another thread recently. From the linked article:
By the time the wort finishes fermenting, a large amount of the polyphenolic material and protein has been removed by adhesion and coagulation, and it has then sunk to the bottom of the fermenter. However, what remains of these two compounds is what can cause chill haze.
Proteins and polyphenols zip around in the beer when it gets cold, and each seeks a partner. But as soon as the beer warms up, the partners separate. As the temperature cools again, the proteins and tannins pick new partners. Over time some of the partners form permanent bonds with each other, and the chill haze becomes permanent haze.
Click to expand...
 
Well, at least the good news is that it hasn't changed the taste of the beer that I can tell. I was just hoping for a nice crisp look. Have any of you used Krystal Clear?
 
Frige said:
I had the same problem with my irish red. Did you use wpl004?
Click to expand...

Chill haze has nothing to do with the type of yeast. As mentioned above chill haze is an interaction between proteins and polyphenols.
 
Ok so why is my blonde made with wpl001 clear as a bell and the irish red made with wpl004 looks like mud? Both were fermented at the same temp, same length of and time and cold crashed to 35 degrees.
 
+1,000,000 to gelatin. I've been brewing for 10 yrs and I thought my beers were pretty clear. I finally tried gelatin on my last APA and it's crystal clear. I mean commercial quality clarity. Gelatin rocks!
 
I tried gelatin for the first time in my blonde ale. Not sure if I used it right so bear that in mind. It didn't seem to help clear it much, if at all. Again, could be completely my fault. I added gelatin to a cup of warm water - heated in microwave in 15 second bursts to 150-160 till it desolved..and then dumped that into a chilled keg.

Anyone do it differently?
 
Moose1231 said:
The best fining agent, in my opinion is gelatin. Irish moss helps, but its never as clear as with gelatin. It may be a little bit more work, but if you want your beer to be crystal clear, use that.

Put 1 pouch of knor no flavor gelatin in 1 cup of hot water (60-70 ºC). Wait for it to cool down (ice bath), put it in your fermenter 2-3 days prior to bottling and but the fermenter in your fridge or in the coolest place you can find (above 0ºC of course). Then when you bottle, just make sure you don't disturb the bottom and you'll have crystal clear beer!
Click to expand...

I'd like to try this. Do you lose any additional beer using this process vs irish moss?
 
b-boy said:
I'd like to try this. Do you lose any additional beer using this process vs irish moss?
Click to expand...

Nope. But I use both Irish Moss and gelatin.

Genuine said:
I added gelatin to a cup of warm water - heated in microwave in 15 second bursts to 150-160 till it desolved..and then dumped that into a chilled keg.

Anyone do it differently?
Click to expand...

Nope, that sounds like the correct procedure. Just make sure you add the gelatine to the water cold, then give it 15-20 minutes to bloom before you start heating it.
 
Frige said:
Ok so why is my blonde made with wpl001 clear as a bell and the irish red made with wpl004 looks like mud? Both were fermented at the same temp, same length of and time and cold crashed to 35 degrees.
Click to expand...

Yeast in suspension has to do with the flocculation rating of that strain.
 
Genuine said:
I tried gelatin for the first time in my blonde ale. Not sure if I used it right so bear that in mind. It didn't seem to help clear it much, if at all. Again, could be completely my fault. I added gelatin to a cup of warm water - heated in microwave in 15 second bursts to 150-160 till it desolved..and then dumped that into a chilled keg.

Anyone do it differently?
Click to expand...

My process is similar to the one here:

http://www.bertusbrewery.com/2012/06/how-to-clear-your-beer-with-gelatin.html

However, instead of mixing the gelatin and heating it up with the water in small burst, I chose to heat the water to a boil first then once it dropped to 160, I added 1/2 a packet of gelatin. Stirred it with the thermometer and gave it maybe 5 min (stirring from time to time) and just dumped it into a chilled keg. Then purged the O2, and gave the keg a gentle shake to mix the gelatin with the beer.

I think the key is that the beer has to be cold when you add the gelatin. Some people say to let it bloom but I've seen cases where the gelatin gets stuck in the out post. Instead, I prefer for it to just be dissolved.

FWIW I also use Whirlfloc.
 
hio3791 said:
+1,000,000 to gelatin. I've been brewing for 10 yrs and I thought my beers were pretty clear. I finally tried gelatin on my last APA and it's crystal clear. I mean commercial quality clarity. Gelatin rocks!
Click to expand...

Unless you are serving people who are vegetarians ;) But how would they know what's in the beer lol.
 
kombat said:
Nope. But I use both Irish Moss and gelatin.

Nope, that sounds like the correct procedure. Just make sure you add the gelatine to the water cold, then give it 15-20 minutes to bloom before you start heating it.
Click to expand...

Ahh, I didn't let it bloom. I bet that was it. I'll have to let it bloom the next and then go on with the procedure.
 
Using irish moss & gelatin here ... and also get crystal clear results. Glad to see that there are different procedures in use for the gelatin. Means that it tends to work well a couple of different ways.

I only use a half-teaspoon gelatin in insta-hot water (190-F). I let it sit for only a few minutes.

When I read up on it last, the gelatin will attract those chill-haze protein-phenols and stick to them. So I always thought you need to induce the chill-haze first, so that the gelatin will work best.

I cold crash my fermenter for a few days, then keg it. While it is still cold, I add the gelatin solution, purge with CO2 and give it a gentle couple of rolls to mix. Then after letting it carb up, it pours clear after about a half-pint.
:mug:
---LexusChris
 
LexusChris said:
Using irish moss & gelatin here ... and also get crystal clear results. Glad to see that there are different procedures in use for the gelatin. Means that it tends to work well a couple of different ways.

I only use a half-teaspoon gelatin in insta-hot water (190-F). I let it sit for only a few minutes.

When I read up on it last, the gelatin will attract those chill-haze protein-phenols and stick to them. So I always thought you need to induce the chill-haze first, so that the gelatin will work best.

I cold crash my fermenter for a few days, then keg it. While it is still cold, I add the gelatin solution, purge with CO2 and give it a gentle couple of rolls to mix. Then after letting it carb up, it pours clear after about a half-pint.
:mug:
---LexusChris
Click to expand...

This one sounds pretty painless. I'm going to give it a try this weekend. The gelatin-water mixture goes in hot?
 
b-boy said:
This one sounds pretty painless. I'm going to give it a try this weekend. The gelatin-water mixture goes in hot?
Click to expand...

Yes. When adding the gelatin to the hot water, I stir it gently with a spoon so that it doesn't get clumpy. Then after it sits a few minutes, I just give it a stir and pour it into the full keg.

Good luck!
--LexusChris
 
I am fairly new to brewing (about 2 years) but I switched to all-grain about a year ago and ever since, my beer has been beautifully clear. The funny thing is, the only fining agent I use is a pinch of Irish moss in the boil. Aside from that, I do some things "wrong" (as far as attaining clarity) - I use a pseudo-counterflow chiller, and no secondary. The only thing I find that effects my clarity (for the first few beers) is whether I use whole hops or pellets - the pellet parts seem to get through my kettle screen.
 
TheWack said:
I am fairly new to brewing (about 2 years) but I switched to all-grain about a year ago and ever since, my beer has been beautifully clear. The funny thing is, the only fining agent I use is a pinch of Irish moss in the boil. Aside from that, I do some things "wrong" (as far as attaining clarity) - I use a pseudo-counterflow chiller, and no secondary. The only thing I find that effects my clarity (for the first few beers) is whether I use whole hops or pellets - the pellet parts seem to get through my kettle screen.
Click to expand...

I switched to all grain recently too. My beers have been much clearer than with extract sooner. 2-3 weeks its very clear compared to 6-8 weeks with extract. No idea why. I still only used irish moss
 
I found that cold-crashing before racking to a keg had the biggest impact on the clarity of my beer. I'm really interested in seeing the additional impact the gelatin will have.

Personally I don't really care that much about how clear my beer is. However, I noticed that people who don't normally drink homebrew would look at it kinda funny if it wasn't clear. It's hard enough to get some people to try it, so I figured clearing it up might make that a little easier.
 
Funny thing about clarity is that I am starting to realize that some craft beers, even Sam Adams are not very clear(depending on the style). I just had a Whitewater IPA, which I figured would have been clear, and that had a ton of junk in it. It is a great brew though
.
 
I too am a regular gelatin user for all of my beers. In addition to the wonderful clarity it provides, it tends to round out the flavor profile of any of the beers Ive added it to. It does tend to affect the hop intensity/aroma of an IPA but only slightly and I can always dry hop after the fact if needed. However, I do carbonate by keg carb with added sugar, before I add gelatin to ensure there's enough yeast to do the job. I transfer to keg, add gelatin, and end up pouring out the first few pints with all the gelatin in it. Not sure if this is vegan friendly since I don't think much, if any, gelatin is actually in the beer since it drops out.
 
mageac, I was curious why you carbonate with sugar if you're kegging. I still bottle, but everyone else I know who kegs force carbonates.
I've never tried gelatin because I've read it will take flavor out of the beer. I do use Irish moss, and haven't had any chill haze problems, yet.
 
MtnHiBrewin said:
mageac, I was curious why you carbonate with sugar if you're kegging. I still bottle, but everyone else I know who kegs force carbonates.
I've never tried gelatin because I've read it will take flavor out of the beer. I do use Irish moss, and haven't had any chill haze problems, yet.
Click to expand...

I think it just tastes better. it's probably in my head then again it's just as easy to add a little corn sugar to a keg, seal it, and let it sit for a few weeks on the side of my keezer. just requires a little more patience. if I need it carbed quickly I still force carb but I try not to.
 
I still use dextrose because I don't have a keezer to put it in. The first couple beers come out cloudy but that's to be expected. I use the co2 disposable cartages. Just found out they have nitrous ones!!!


mageac said:
I think it just tastes better. it's probably in my head then again it's just as easy to add a little corn sugar to a keg, seal it, and let it sit for a few weeks on the side of my keezer. just requires a little more patience. if I need it carbed quickly I still force carb but I try not to.
Click to expand...
 
so if you don't keep them in a keezer do you bottle directly after keg carbing?
 
The last beer I made was a Chinook and Simcoe IPA - I used a warflock tablet at 15 minutes left to the boil and after the first couple of pints, it poured beautifully clear and didn't affect the hop aroma whatsoever. Huge fan of warflock tablets now!
 
I have my current batch of amber ale in my kegerator cold crashing in the carboy. I'm going to keg tomorrow and when it's carbed, I'll let you know of the results. I used whirfloc and cold crashing for this one. It does look a bit cloudy in the carboy but we'll see how it is in the glass.
 
image-3820100929.jpg

image-1708813609.jpg

Lil bit of condensation on the glass but I'm happy with the way it came out!
 
I've used whirlfloc and gelatin and it works great. What I've found works just as well is whirlfloc and 2 weeks of cold conditioning for all of my beers after they have carbed, or been kegged. This keeps me from getting too excited and drinking green beer, and all of my beers have been crystal clear. Gelatin won't hurt anything, but my preference is to add as little as possible to my beer. Less additives mean fewer opportunities for mistakes.

I've found that brewing, like most things, yields a better product the less you mess with it.
 
http://www.whitelabs.com/other-products/wln4000-clarity-ferm

The above stuff will kill chill haze. It also helps bring other proteins out of your beer, including Gluten. I used it for that reason (attempting to come up with a tolerable beer for an intolerant friend).

A guy did a video about it on youtube that you should be able to find quickly.

I did a few beers where I pitched the Charity-ferm in half the batch and there was no difference in flavor or mouthfeel. It does remove the chill haze. I have yet to test the gluten differences.

The only downside is it adds ~ $2.50 to the cost of each 5 gallons...
 
A combination of Irish moss and isinglass used at different times tends to clear the yeast better, but since there will be less yeast at bottling, carbonation will take longer. I use a primary, secondary, then tertiary process and some of my friends then filter the beer and use a pressurizing carbonation process for really clear, no chill-haze beer, but you will get very acceptable beer without filtering when you use a combinatioon of Irish moss, then isinglass (about three days before bottling).
 
MtnHiBrewin said:
mageac, I was curious why you carbonate with sugar if you're kegging. I still bottle, but everyone else I know who kegs force carbonates.
I've never tried gelatin because I've read it will take flavor out of the beer. I do use Irish moss, and haven't had any chill haze problems, yet.
Click to expand...

Sounds like Cask Conditioning to me...or rather Keg Conditioning.. :)
 

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