Saison BBD Saison Furtif

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iheartcraftbeer said:
Brewing up this one on Saturday. According to Hopville, here are the stats. Pretty excited to watch this yeast have sex with itself. The only thing I'm concerned about is ferm temp. I'll have to keep my space heater on for the first few days to keep it warm enough.

Brew day went without a hitch! Hit 1.064 OG. The next morning I had a nice, thick krauesen and the airlock was bubbling away. The space heater was set on 78F for the first 24 hours or so. I've knocked it down 1-2 deg since.

I will post tasting notes eventually. Thanks again for the recipe, Cat.
Click to expand...
 
Re ferm temp, I hope I didn't screw my batch up. Got my wort down to 95 via chiller and strained to carboy, topped off to 5.5 gallons with cool water and the temp was 76-78 so I pitched my 1L starter (3711). Wanted to ferm in low 80's so wrapped a heating pad on at lowest temp and when I went to bed was merrily perking away at about 82. When I got up this morning, was in the mid 90's. Shut it off and am letting it get back into the mid to low 80's and will try to hold it there, but question is, did the overnight in the 90's hurt anything? Still lots of fermentation activity and I love the slightly sweet aroma it's giving off.
 
Welp, as much as my friends and I love this beer, the judges thought it was "good"

Here's my 2 scoresheets for the Cascade Brewers Cup Pro Am (500+ entries)
Judge 1 (non-BJCP)
Aroma 6/12
Very fruity, spiciness. Maltiness in the background. A yeasty, mustiness back there too.

Appearance 1/3???
Brilliantly clear golden color. Small head dissipates quickly (I disagree, this head lasts a while)

Flavor 12/20
Fruity caramel (????) maltiness, nice balance with hops, but not so much else. A little spiciness.

Mouthfeel 2/5
Medium body and carbonation. Almost syrupy, with strong alcohol note that helps clean the finish. THicker than the style would indicate. No so dry and refreshing (WTF? It ended at 1.002!!!!)

Overall Impression 5/10
Nice flavors in a good base example of the style (ok so why not a higher score?). The flavors don't match the gravity however (I say that's a good thing), and carbonation issues contribute to a cloying middle. Consider less attenuation or fermentation temps schedule. (wait, it's not dry enough but you want less attenuation????)

Final Score: 26

Judge 2 (certified)
Aroma 7/12
Fruity, spicy nose with malt sweetness underneath. Light sour/tart notes - good for style. Dusty/yeasty flavor should not be there (wait, you've tasted it?)

Appearance 2/3
Very clear, copper color. Pours with a large head but fades quickly

Flavor 9/20
Fruity, peppery flavors with sweet malt backbone. Finishes with a cloying syrup flavor

Mouthfeel 3/5
Light to medium body. Moderate carbonation. Finishes with a hot/warming lingering aftertaste. Cloying sweetness

Overall Impression 5/10
Elimiate the cloying sweetness to make this ber a dry, refreshing example of the style. Fruity, spicy aroma and flavor are good for style. Watch fermentation temps. (I thought they should be high...and they were maintained with a spare room with its own temp control...)

Final score 26

Both judges marked middle of the road for "Stylistic Accuracy", "Technical Merit", and "Intangibles"



So, I guess what I've learned is that maybe I should drop some of the base malt to get rid of some of the cloying sweetness and hot alcohol flavors. Maybe I'll ferment at a lower temperature and add some adjuncts for the spice.

All of that said, I still think this is a fantastic beer and I have yet to find a saison I like more. Brew it, drink it, love it.
 
I'm not surprised. When I sent this in to NHC once two of the judges said that it needed to be fermented further, yet I took it down right to 1.000 and it was very bone dry.

Yours does sound like it might have a little more sweetness than I usually get in mine. Not sure why that would be. Or you just got lame judges. That's been known to happen. :D One of mine also pointed out things in it that should be in that style of beer, yet the BJCP guide specifically says they should be. *shrug*
 
ChshreCat said:
I'm not surprised. When I sent this in to NHC once two of the judges said that it needed to be fermented further, yet I took it down right to 1.000 and it was very bone dry.

Yours does sound like it might have a little more sweetness than I usually get in mine. Not sure why that would be. Or you just got lame judges. That's been known to happen. :D One of mine also pointed out things in it that should be in that style of beer, yet the BJCP guide specifically says they should be. *shrug*
Click to expand...

Even my Lite version has these "faults" that started at 1054 and ended at 1002. (6.8%) more Judges need to taste this yeast. It's a beast and leaves a bunch of malt character behind. My lite didn't do well in competition either (waiting on score sheet) but got beat by another dryer saison from what I've been told.

This yeast leaves a sweet sticky good body even at low FG.

Sorry I LIKE IT! non beer judges picked up lemon, raisin (strisslespalt) and an unknown sweetness... of which some said pineapple.

Had some BMC crowd taste it and said WOW... great beer! Always a crowd pleaser. Saisons rarely take a best of show as it's got a funky thang going... just waiting for judge sheets and crowd sheets.... love to see crowd sheets...
 
Brewed this up last night, also my first partial mash so it was a good learning experience. Only change I made (mainly because I wasn't paying attention) was I dumped a whole ounce of Saaz for the 10 minute addition, woops.

For my first partial, I was pretty happy, my OG was close, but a little off. It came out right around 1.060, pitched a small starter, and already had pretty furious airlock activity this morning. Going to need to keep an eye on it and keep the blow off tube handy. :D

It's also nice to not have to worry about temp control much, since I can only cool one batch at a time, this is letting me have multiples going at the same time.
 
Hey Cat, question regarding FG:

I brewed this on 3/03 and my OG was 1.064. I checked the gravity last Saturday (3/24) and it was 1.008. I roused the yeast cake a bit, and then measured again last night (3/28) but it's still 1.008. I was hoping to bottle this Saturday (3/31). What do you suggest?
 
I'd expect it to slowly go down a few more points. I'd give it another week and if it's the same then I'd go ahead and bottle but use a little less bottling sugar than I'd otherwise use, just in case.
 
David8464 said:
Brewed this up last night, also my first partial mash so it was a good learning experience. Only change I made (mainly because I wasn't paying attention) was I dumped a whole ounce of Saaz for the 10 minute addition, woops.

For my first partial, I was pretty happy, my OG was close, but a little off. It came out right around 1.060, pitched a small starter, and already had pretty furious airlock activity this morning. Going to need to keep an eye on it and keep the blow off tube handy. :D

It's also nice to not have to worry about temp control much, since I can only cool one batch at a time, this is letting me have multiples going at the same time.
Click to expand...


I learned the hard way...Do the blow off tube first and then put the airlock on after a few days = No mess to clean up and no worrying about infection.
 
Yeah, I usually do the blow off tube right at the start, but since I started this late after work, it was a bit late by the time I finished and I just shoved an airlock on it. I'll be swapping it out when I get home to be safe if it last that long, but I've got it in a spare 7.8g bucket I had, so hopefully that will be enough until then.
 
i cant wait to make this one again. i only have 3 left and im bringing them to my local homebrew club for BJCP tasting guidelines on wednesday.
 
I enjoy this beer so much as it is, this is how I'll brew it for my own consumption. But... It might be interesting to make a BJCP friendly version to brew for competitions.
 
I had two bjcp judges (as well as a whole group of people) try this beer. If this beer had been a little younger, I think it would have been better but they both scored it as an average of 35. Yay for me! Brewing again in a couple weeks. Gonna keep my temps a bit down this time and see how it works out; first ferment was at ~80°F
 
Right on. Threw this down last night. First brew in quite a while. It was kind of spur of the moment, the local shop didn't have the 3711 so I used the 3724. Despite mashing it in a bag, and then ladling hot water over the grains my SG was at 1.070, which was much better then I though would happen. Now I have it in the warmest part of my house, in a bucket of water to keep the temp stable. I can just barely see the air lock over the table and it is going crazy. I am pretty excited about this one. Let us see in a few weeks.
 
i helped a friend brew this up a few weeks ago. Checked the gravity on it today (still had krausen on top...so we thought it was still fermenting)...and it was all the way down to 1.002 (down from 1.056). We totally missed adding the belgian candy sugar. My question...can we still add it this late? It would have been 2 weeks from brew day Friday past. Can we add it and maybe rouse up the yeast a bit when we add it?

Thanks
 
Well, after about 3 weeks in primary, I popped the lid and took a sample. I guess I had to see it to believe it, I stared at my hydrometer for a few seconds, pulled it out, made sure it was clean, and spun it around. Each time the result was the same 1.000. I even double checked with my refractometer and got the same result. Very excited about this one, I'll be racking it to a secondary in just a bit to let it age a while, but just from the sample, it tasted and smelled awesome.
 
Checked today. It has slowed down a lot. We are now at about 1.025. It is sitting in the high seventies so I am hoping that helps. Just want this to finish. Working in the garden today and all I had to drink after was a few PBRs. Not bad, but not good either.
 
Mine only took a little under 4 weeks to get down to the 1.000 level before I racked it into a secondary. It fermented the first week in the 75-78ish range and at the end of the first week when fermentation had slowed, I added the extra sugar and it kicked back up for about another week. The last two weeks it settled around 72-75ish and finished out.

I usually keep my house in the low 70's this time of year so I just left it at ambient without any other heating/cooling sources and let the yeast do it's thing.

Oh I forgot to add, I made a starter that was a little under 2L, decanted, and pitched. That probably helped it get going and made it easier to finish out so low.
 
I am going to brew this again once things warm up a tad bit more here, 11 gallon batch this time around. I dont want the ferment to get high in the 80s like it did last time and I am only going to add a lb of sugar for the whole 11 gal batch; I feel this beer turned into rocket fuel later on with too much fusel flavors.

With a bit of temp control (by temp control, I mean keeping it in the mid 70's range), I think this might turn out a little cleaner.

Since I am doing 11 gallons, I plan on splitting the batch in half and doing one like stated above and the other... i am going to attempt to sour it.

o.m.g. could you imagine this beer with a sour tinge to it? epic.
 
Tried my first bottle tonight. Could use a little more carbonation and could be a little drier, but by far my best batch. Will for sure be brewing again. Even made the lady tell me I should brew for our wedding.
 
I need some help!

I made the original recipe, except I pitched two vials of WLP565 (no time to wait for a online order of 3711). OG was around 1.060, ambient temp is 82. Fermentation slowed after only 3 days, so I pulled a sample and it measured 1.010. I added the sugar the next day. The yeast chewed through the sugar in a day; now I'm getting very slow airlock activity (day 7), but I haven't checked gravity since day 3.

If I let this go for 3-4 weeks, will the yeast still be up for some priming sugar? Or should I add some 001 or dry champagne yeast at some point? (I'm not planning on racking to secondary). When would I add that yeast?

Anyone else had such fast fermentation?

Thanks
 
You would have to leave it for months before having any worries at all about not having yeast for priming.
 
Thanks for the quick replies. I took a sample; it's down to 1.008 and tasty. I'll give it a few weeks for the yeast to do the rest of their thing...
 
Hey ChshreCat, on the grain bill we have:
4.50 lb Pale Liquid Extract [Boil for 5 min] Extract 33.33 %
5.00 lb Pilsner (2 Row) Bel (2.0 SRM) Grain 37.04 %
2.00 lb Munich Malt (9.0 SRM) Grain 14.81 %
1.00 lb Wheat Malt, Bel (2.0 SRM) Grain 7.41 %

For the WHEAT Malt.....is that white wheat? Red? Weyermann? For some reason I'm always having trouble distinguishing the right kinds of wheat for my beers.
 
I've used red with great results... I
need to do another full strength soon, been too long!

My LITE version took a 4th place at a small local competition a few months back.
 
Slight thread revival.

Looking to brew the extract of this in a week or two, but have one question. What are your thoughts on swapping out the crystal 20L with Belgian aromatic? I already have the aromatic and have no plans for it so I was thinking it may work in this.

6lbs Light dry malt extract
1lb wheat dry malt extract
1lb sugar (table, light belgian candy sugar or corn sugar) With out some of the other malts I would suggest a light belgian candy sugar for xtra flavor.
1 lb 20 lvb crystal malt steeped - swap with Aromatic
1/3 lb 80 lvb crystal steeped

needed the extra 1/3 lb 80 lvb crystal to get srm back up.
specs:

OG: 1.067
FG:1.017
IBU:25
SRM:8
ABV:6.5%ing it may work in this.
 
bolus14 said:
Slight thread revival.

Looking to brew the extract of this in a week or two, but have one question. What are your thoughts on swapping out the crystal 20L with Belgian aromatic? I already have the aromatic and have no plans for it so I was thinking it may work in this.

6lbs Light dry malt extract
1lb wheat dry malt extract
1lb sugar (table, light belgian candy sugar or corn sugar) With out some of the other malts I would suggest a light belgian candy sugar for xtra flavor.
1 lb 20 lvb crystal malt steeped - swap with Aromatic
1/3 lb 80 lvb crystal steeped

needed the extra 1/3 lb 80 lvb crystal to get srm back up.
specs:

OG: 1.067
FG:1.017
IBU:25
SRM:8
ABV:6.5%ing it may work in this.
Click to expand...

It'll change the beer a little bit, but not in a bad way I think.

btw... your username... 14 grams per unit?
 
Great, looks like I've got my next batch set then.

As far as my username... Its actually a high school nickname that just "stuck," pun intended. 14 was the number I wore for basketball and baseball, so not quite 14g per unit :)
 
bolus14 said:
Great, looks like I've got my next batch set then.

As far as my username... Its actually a high school nickname that just "stuck," pun intended. 14 was the number I wore for basketball and baseball, so not quite 14g per unit :)
Click to expand...

Ahh. I was just curious because my wife uses an insulin pump and when she has it send an extra dose of insulin to counteract the carbs from something she eats, that's called a "bolus". :)
 
Right. It was a joke when a friend said it but for some god forsaken reason it stayed with me and still to this day, 14 years after high school,friends still call me it.
 
Brewed the extract version yesterday with my noted modifications. The hydro sample was the best tasting sample of my first 5 brews, I can't wait for this one.

I'm just hoping the yeast doesnt give any clove taste to it, in a spicy manner would be ok I just don't want clove. I really want the citrusy like flavor of the hydro.

My OG was 1.072, a little higher than I wanted or expected. If the yeast chews this down to 05 - 01 then this will end up being around 8%. I would've liked something a little more sessionable, but not complaining.
 
I've never noticed any clove flavor in mine. Just very citrusy with a little spice and funk to it. The citrus aspect actually reminds me of Fresca, actually. In a good way.
 
Good to hear, I'm really hoping mine comes out the same.

The water from my starter had a little clove taste to it. Maybe a difference between WY3711 and WLP566?
 

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