Over Attenuating Yeast - How is it Possible?

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ultravista

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Confused ... :confused:

I brewed a Rogue Double Dead Guy clone, mashed at 152F - it started at 1.084 and finished at 1.010, fermented with Wyeast Pacman. No mash out.

Beersmith calculates that as a 82.7% attenuation. OG measured with a refractometer and FG measured with two hydrometers.

Wyeast's stats are 72-78% attenuation for this strain.

The yeast was about 11 months old, smelled and tasted good, and pretty creamy white. I made a 2L starter with the decanted slurry and it took off in about 4 to 6 hours.

I hit the wort with O2 and pitched the decanted starter. Within 4 to 8 hours it began to show signs of fermentation.

The beer fermented @ 65F in a refrigerator (measured by a thermowell) for about 3 weeks. I let it sit on the yeast cake @ 45F for another three weeks. Approximately 6 weeks total.

This recipe should have finished around 1.018 - 1.020, mine however continued to 1.010. As a result, it is much drier with an alcohol bite. At 6 weeks old, it's not so green anymore.

With that being said, what in your opinion might account for the higher attenuation?

If anything, I suspect old/aged yeast would be less attenuating, unless it mutated.

What about sitting on the yeast cake for an extended period? After three weeks @ 65F, the yeast should have been entirely done, and at 45F, the yeast should be dormant and inactive.

Would over pitching push it lower?

Would no mash out increase attenuation?

Any ideas?
 
Would no mash out increase attenuation?

In most cases, yes, it will. If you don't mash out, you keep converting starch all the way to the brew kettle, until you denature heating up to boil.

Even Wyeast has stated those numbers they publish are largely useless. To en up with a higher OG, you might just have to mash higher on this recipe next time. Nothing beats experience with a strain, and I've never used this, so I'm just throwing out suggestions.
 
Confused ... :confused:

I brewed a Rogue Double Dead Guy clone, mashed at 152F - it started at 1.084 and finished at 1.010, fermented with Wyeast Pacman. No mash out.
Pacman is a BEAST
Beersmith calculates that as a 82.7% attenuation. OG measured with a refractometer and FG measured with two hydrometers.

Wyeast's stats are 72-78% attenuation for this strain.
Dont listen to these numbers
The yeast was about 11 months old, smelled and tasted good, and pretty creamy white. I made a 2L starter with the decanted slurry and it took off in about 4 to 6 hours.

I hit the wort with O2 and pitched the decanted starter. Within 4 to 8 hours it began to show signs of fermentation.

The beer fermented @ 65F in a refrigerator (measured by a thermowell) for about 3 weeks. I let it sit on the yeast cake @ 45F for another three weeks. Approximately 6 weeks total.
Next time take it off the cake around 3-4weeks, i find that leaving it on the cake could actaully have it attentuate furthur when you have such a beast of a strin like pacman.
This recipe should have finished around 1.018 - 1.020, mine however continued to 1.010. As a result, it is much drier with an alcohol bite. At 6 weeks old, it's not so green anymore.
At 6 weeks from grain this is still pretty green IMO. WAit it out that tinge might fade and mellow.
With that being said, what in your opinion might account for the higher attenuation?
PACMAN!!
If anything, I suspect old/aged yeast would be less attenuating, unless it mutated.
Unless you have an infection this is not likely since you used a starter to step up. Also like stated, pacman is a beast
What about sitting on the yeast cake for an extended period? After three weeks @ 65F, the yeast should have been entirely done, and at 45F, the yeast should be dormant and inactive.
Techniquly yes the yeast go dormant at that temp but IMO "stuff" on a molecualr level are still happening...
Would over pitching push it lower?
Yes, does the beer taste bland? Overpitching causes fewer esters from the yeast growth phase
Would no mash out increase attenuation?
As someone else stated, yes, no mash out will not denature the enzymes thus continuting to convert oushing attenuation higher till boiled
Any ideas?

Bolded my answers for you
Hope it helps

General thing is that pacman is a beast and in my experience leaving any strain on the yeast cake for more than 2-3weeks will push furthur attenuation.
 
I got 90% AA each time I used the Chimay yeast and their guidelines say 74-78%.
 
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