PID Calibration Troubleshooting

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Chris7687

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Finally have everything wired up, but I am having troubles setting up my PID. I have a 1/16 DIN PID Temperature Controller (SSR control output) (SYL-2352) wired to a Liquid tight RTD sensor, 4 in, 1/4 NPT Thread (PT100-L100NPT). I tired following Kal's PID settings but I get a weird flashing message when I try to accomplish the first step of setting the Sn to 21. It flashes "-343", then "or AL", and then "100". I am pretty positive my 3 wires are wired correctly.

I was hoping someone could help walk me through this as I am lost with this thing!
 
You likely have an intermittent problem in your wiring, inside the PID, or in the temp probe.

SYL-2352 manual is here:

http://auberins.com/images/Manual/Manual version 3.4.pdf

8. Error Message and trouble shooting
8.1 Display orAL

This is an input error message. The possible reasons are: the sensor is not
connected correctly; the input setting is wrong type; or the sensor is defective.
In this case, the instrument terminates its control function automatically, and
the output value is fixed according to the parameter OUTL. If this happens
when using thermocouple sensor, you can short terminal 4 and 5 with a copper
wire. If the display shows ambient temperature, the thermocouple is defective.
If it still displays orAL, check the input setting, Sn, to make sure it is set to the
right thermocouple type. If the Sn setting is correct, the controller is defective.
For RTD sensors, check the input setting first because most controllers are
shipped with the input set for thermocouples. Then check the wiring. The two
red wires should be connected to terminals 3 and 4. The clear wire should be
connected to terminal 5.
Click to expand...

Use the PID settings outlined here: http://www.theelectricbrewery.com/control-panel-setup

Kal
 
Had my wires switched on the PID. Thanks for all the great support you have provided Kal. Couldn't have even imagined doing this without the support you provided via your website.
 
Kal - During my auto tuning, my PID stopped at 204. It wouldn't go past it even after letting it sit for an hour. I turned it off. Hoping a "reboot" might help it out. Any suggestions? It had a very small boil to it, if you could even call it that. It definitely was nothing I would expect for a 100% rolling boil, so I cdon't think believe 8 degrees off on the pB set could be the issue.
 
Hey Kal, sorry about my post as it was kind of scatter brained. Here is my situation, I am using my kettle in for BIAB. So in essence I am combining all three kettles into one, as I am sure you know this. I went ahead and programmed my PID to your specs for the default settings, but since I am using my kettle to heat up the water all the way to boil I had to combine some of the settings. I made the PID's A-M mode 0, but when I ran the auto-tuning it was in Auto mode. I said 100% because I am assuming when it's in auto mode the element is firing at 100% power. The water at 204 on my PID had a minor boil to it, so what I meant was even if I thought it was stuck at 204 but really it was 212 (miscalculated my pB adjustment) it was still a very weak boil.

I am assuming that either the PID in A-M mode 2 or it just had a brain fart which caused it to stop at 204. I can't get to it again until Monday.
 
When the element is on it's always firing at 100% power. A PID can't fire an element at 50% power. It's either on or off.

To control how vigorous a boil is, duty cycle is used in manual mode. This means setting the PID to 50% in manual mode the element will be on at 100% power for 1 second, then complete off for 1 second. The "average" is 50%.

I don't understand why you're at 204F, but just to be sure: Don't do your auto-tune at boiling temperatures. Put the PID into automatic mode, set it to something around mash temp (say 154F), fill the kettle with cold water, start heating, and then start the auto-tune when the temperarature is about 10 degrees below the set point (~144F). It won't go to up to 204F. If it does, something is set wrong or wired wrong.

Good luck!

Kal
 
kal said:
I don't understand why you're at 204F, but just to be sure: Don't do your auto-tune at boiling temperatures. Put the PID into automatic mode, set it to something around mash temp (say 154F), fill the kettle with cold water, start heating, and then start the auto-tune when the temperarature is about 10 degrees below the set point (~144F). It won't go to up to 204F. If it does, something is set wrong or wired wrong.
Click to expand...

Something must be set wrong (hoping not wired wrong) because I set it to auto tune at 144 and it ran all the way up to 204.
 
Yup. Sounds like something is set wrong or wired wrong. Could also be something defective.

Try a simple test: Set the PID to AUTO mode and set it to around 100F and try to heat some cold water to that temp. Without having done auto-tuning it should get to that temp and stay pretty close. Auto-tuning just makes it more accurate.

If you go more than a degree or two above (and keep rising) something is not right and odds are that the element is firing continuously.

If the little "OUT" light on the PID is always on once you go past that 100F set point then the problem is in the PID settings, the PID is defective, or you're not actually in AUTO mode (hit the A/M button - the A-M light should be OFF when in AUTO mode).

Check the SSR light. If it doesn't go on/off in unision with the PID "OUT" light but stays on all the time (or is always off) then you've wired incorrectly or the SSR is defective (always on).

Good luck!

Kal
 
as an aside, someone previously had a very similar sounding issue and had the wrong probe setting (using thermo with pid setting or vice versa). op, verify that your probe type and setting for pid
 
kal said:
Yup. Sounds like something is set wrong or wired wrong. Could also be something defective.

Try a simple test: Set the PID to AUTO mode and set it to around 100F and try to heat some cold water to that temp. Without having done auto-tuning it should get to that temp and stay pretty close. Auto-tuning just makes it more accurate.

If you go more than a degree or two above (and keep rising) something is not right and odds are that the element is firing continuously.

If the little "OUT" light on the PID is always on once you go past that 100F set point then the problem is in the PID settings, the PID is defective, or you're not actually in AUTO mode (hit the A/M button - the A-M light should be OFF when in AUTO mode).

Check the SSR light. If it doesn't go on/off in unision with the PID "OUT" light but stays on all the time (or is always off) then you've wired incorrectly or the SSR is defective (always on).

Good luck!

Kal
Click to expand...

Kal,
When I set my PID to 100, it went to 100 just fine and then shut off. The out light and the SSR light both shut off in unison.

When I went to set the temp to 154 and tried doing the AT set to 2, it ran all the way up to 166 before I shut it off. I am not sure why this keeps happening. Also, when I set it to AT the A/M light didn't flash on and off like you say it does on the Setup page.

Here is a picture of my PID. I had an knowledge electrician/technician help me wire it. The only thing I see funny, which doesn't follow your schematic is the nuetral wire (yellow #9) running to #13.



 
#13 is part of ALARM1. It probably has to do with that. While it's nearly impossible to troubleshoot wiring with pictures, nothing jumps out at me as being incorrect. Without sitting down and playing with it in person, I'm not sure why you're experiencing the issues you are. Sorry.

Kal
 
At this point, if you can successfully enter into Autotune mode (AT=2), and the A/M light is not flashing, and the element just stays on, you should probably call Auber.

Is it possible that you aborted the autotune before it finished? Probably not, but since you have already verified that it can heat to 100F and automatically stop, and if you really did get into autotune mode correctly, I cannot think of anything else.
 
Hey guys, got it resolved. Nothing wrong with the wiring. Turns out you can not AT the PID when it is in A-M mode. A-M should be to set to 1, not 0. Setting to 1 means it is unlocked for manual mode, but still in PID mode. AM-0 means controller is in manual mode, there is nothing to tune in manual mode.

Still trying to figure out the percentage to use on manual mode. Made my first beer on the system yesterday and seemed to go perfect. Ended up a little short on the amount of liquid, but that's fine. First time trial and error learning.
 
If you're using a 5500w 240v element, then something around 60-65% will give you a great rolling boil.
If you're using a 4500w 240v element, then it's more like 65-70% for the rolling boil. Experience will teach you.

Glad you figured it out. I was wondering why were trying to tune it in Manual mode.
 

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