Fermentation lag at lower temp

I brewed Dortmunder export from Brewing Classical Styles, and per instructions I lowered the temp to 52f before pitching White Lab German Lager Yeast 830. There is no activity after 16 hours. Is this a normal lag for pitching at lower temp or did I do something wrong?

This is my first time brewing a lager. Thanks for the reply.

My first lager was with Czech Budejovice and took 36 hours to show any signs of activity. I raised my temperature from 52*F the first day to 53*F the second then 54*F the third. Then left it there until the tenth day when I checked SG and started a slow rise to 65*F for D-rest. It is now in lagering at 36*F -37*F for 4 - 6 weeks. It didn't have any hints of Diacetyl but I did the D-rest just to be sure. The sulphur was there but should go away during lagering. My plan is to dry hop the last seven days and cold crash to 33*F for the last 48 hours.

sunnybm said:

I brewed Dortmunder export from Brewing Classical Styles, and per instructions I lowered the temp to 52f before pitching White Lab German Lager Yeast 830. There is no activity after 16 hours. Is this a normal lag for pitching at lower temp or did I do something wrong?

This is my first time brewing a lager. Thanks for the reply.

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52*F isn't cold for a lager pitch. Last one I did (5 days ago) I pitched Wyeast 2124 at 48*F and it started activity in less than 14 hours. I now have it set at 50*F and it's still churning away. I believe that Yooper pitches her lagers at 45*F.

Did you just pitch a vial or make a starter? If just a vial, you significantly underpitched as lagers generally require almost twice as much yeast as a comparable ale. That would cause it to have a slow start and possibly a stalled ferment later.

BigFloyd said:

52*F isn't cold for a lager pitch. Last one I did (5 days ago) I pitched Wyeast 2124 at 48*F and it started activity in less than 14 hours. I now have it set at 50*F and it's still churning away. I believe that Yooper pitches her lagers at 45*F.

Did you just pitch a vial or make a starter? If just a vial, you significantly underpitched as lagers generally require almost twice as much yeast as a comparable ale. That would cause it to have a slow start and possibly a stalled ferment later.

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I used two vials for 5g batch. Still it has no activity (bubbling in airlock), my homebrew store guy said that it is ok to not have any activity because of bottom fermentation and I should just take a gravity reading after 3-4days and a move towards final gravity will indicate fermentation. Still, if there is fermentation then CO2 is bring produced and there should be bubbling in airlock. Right?

sunnybm said:

Still, if there is fermentation then CO2 is bring produced and there should be bubbling in airlock. Right?

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Nope. The airlock is not a completely reliable indicator of fermentation. Any small leak will let the CO2 pressure out by a route other than pushing through the StarSan in your airlock. Plenty of fermentations happen and finish fully with zero airlock activity.

BigFloyd said:

Nope. The airlock is not a completely reliable indicator of fermentation. Any small leak will let the CO2 pressure out by a route other than pushing through the StarSan in your airlock. Plenty of fermentations happen and finish fully with zero airlock activity.

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Sure, it's possible, but I have to ask: where are people getting these buckets that are so leaky that one would see no airlock activity?

afr0byte said:

Sure, it's possible, but I have to ask: where are people getting these buckets that are so leaky that one would see no airlock activity?

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Not sure. I suspect most of the leaks are because of "operator error". I keep my lid gaskets clean and make sure that the lid is fully seated each time. My airlocks always bubble, but all it takes is a small compromise of the seal and the CO2 will seek the path of least resistance.

I have seen one kit bucket that didn't have a gasket. The brewer who owned it said that the airlock still bubbled, but I would think that the tiniest of misalignment would allow leakage.

BigFloyd said:

Not sure. I suspect most of the leaks are because of "operator error". I keep my lid gaskets clean and make sure that the lid is fully seated each time. My airlocks always bubble, but all it takes is a small compromise of the seal and the CO2 will seek the path of least resistance.

I have seen one kit bucket that didn't have a gasket. The brewer who owned it said that the airlock still bubbled, but I would think that the tiniest of misalignment would allow leakage.

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Sure this would potentially cause problems at the beginning and end of fermentation, but it'd have to be a pretty large leak to not see any bubbling during active fermentation.

sunnybm said:

I brewed Dortmunder export from Brewing Classical Styles, and per instructions I lowered the temp to 52f before pitching White Lab German Lager Yeast 830. There is no activity after 16 hours. Is this a normal lag for pitching at lower temp or did I do something wrong?

This is my first time brewing a lager. Thanks for the reply.

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16 hours is a bit early to worry, especially with a lager. I would have recommending pitching an active starter instead of going with the two packets, as I like to know I have a healthy and active number of yeast before I pitch. I would wait another 24 hours before you need to start to worry. In the meantime, keep it in the recommended temperature for your yeast strain and let it be.

You might see some recommendations to bump the temperatures up until you see visible activity and then bring it back down to the recommend temperature range. I really recommend NOT doing this because your yeast will produce off-flavors when fermenting warm that can be easily avoided if you just them ferment at the recommend range.

Update: Took a gravity reading after 48hr and as I suspected there was no activity, no change from starting gravity. So I pitched two packs of S-23 and after a day airlock is starting to bubble. Reading the responses, I believe my mistake was not pitching enough yeast, I should have made a starter. Lesson learned.

Thank you all for your responses.

sunnybm said:

Reading the responses, I believe my mistake was not pitching enough yeast, I should have made a starter. Lesson learned.

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That's a good lesson to learn, especially when brewing a lager.

Was the first yeast (830) by any chance warm when you pitched it into the 52F wort?

SpeedYellow said:

Was the first yeast (830) by any chance warm when you pitched it into the 52F wort?

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No, i was in 50s when I pitched it.

Ok. Just thought I'd ask in case you didn't already know that yeast don't like cold shocks.